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whack purges and the suppression of COTO...

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How fucked up is THIS:

recent internal correspondence:
M.. he's been banned again for posting a comment about Leser's appearance on fox. He didn't insult he didn't curse, he just stated a point and the comment was deleted.. Now M just found out he's banned.

Rady Ananda(editor for god sake!)is banned as well as William Whitten. So far I'm still here but not for long I"m sure. This is my please write and I'll sent you info on what's going on with coto. If you have any other email addys other than the people I mentioned above.. let them know the purge of coto is on at oen.

So i guess ol wp aint far behind... just like on SC... "gatekeeper" sites (as Curt sez)... when the moolah flows in. the dissidents get bounced. The flunkies and flacks are everywhere...
Thanks, Waldo.

I had just posted this in the wrong fred:

Rady Ananda, a senior editor at OEN for many years and one of those who voted unanimously to ban me, has just herself been banned from OEN, apparently for writing something critical of Obama.

My friend Jim Eldon asked me if I knew of others besides William Whitten and Rady who have been banned and I mentioned Curt and Georgianne Nienaber, but being absent-minded in my old age, I couldn't think of others off hand and told him I'd post here to ask if other folks know.

I also told him that Rady, having been a senior editor for so long, would know of everyone who was banned, .but probably, even pissed as she is, retains too much misguided loyalty to fascism to make information public that Rob Kall prefers remain secret.

Maybe COTO has already become COTB--the Coalition Of The Banned.
It's funny how you diss me, Mark, when you continue to invite me to join your blogsites. Is this misguided loyalty of which you've accused me?

And, whether you will ever admit it or not, Mark, your comments at OEN were so full of hatred and single-minded focus on the subjects of interest to you that you exemplify why comment moderation can be a good thing.

Everyone can bitch about being banned, but you, Mark, know how to ruin a discussion with hostility that you have no room to bitch.

Even here, when you smile at my face, you diss me behind my back. Tell me. Are you so self absorbed that you cannot entertain the possibility that your hostilities cost you friends, as well as posting privileges?
Well... there WAS a spate of paranoia when the googie site went down. Water under the bridge.

No more dissin on the Radymeister, OK? She got the inside scoop and she writes good poop. I hope she will post some of her work here.

Rady bit me a coupla times too... in her editing capacity. But she was fair and civil and willing to listen. I have had few other "editors" who did as much. And I been a nasty biter meself at times... 'fraid I ran ol Bessa off and he aint been back since. My bad. And just the other night I told a whole class fulla peeps that they "wrote like they were laying pipe."

Editing ist fahlt mir schwehr.
Well, Curt and Waldo were there, and they don't think my comments were full of hatred, Rady.

Anyone else here who followed my stuff on OEN before Rady and the other senior editors unanimously voted to permanently ban me who thinks my posts were full of hatred?

As for my single-minded focus on subjects of interest to me, I appreciate the compliment, but I don't really deserve it. I often stray into diversions of trivia and humor. That's because the subjects of interest to me have a common factor of anti-fascism, and it would be impossible for me to remain focused entirely on anti-fascism without bursting a blood vessel.

Now that Waldo's post has been deleted from OEN and Waldo himself banned, I hope he will post it here so that you can read it, Rady.

What we're doing here is dissing fascism. What we're doing in this specific topic, is dissing the fascism at OEN. To the extent that you were part of it and defend it, you can take that personally.

If you are no longer part of it and do not support it, you won't.

Some of my friends have remained friends as I have been banned from many websites. Every time I'm banned from a website, friends I made there stay in touch and stay friends. All my friends are aware that my anti-fascism will inevitably get me banned from fascist websites and most have had the same experience themselves numerous times.

I don't have fascist friends, Rady. ALL my friends are anti-fascist. I'm not looking for fascist friends, fascist privileges, or fascist status. Hostility towards fascism is love of humanity and our habitat the earth, or what's left of it and of us after thousands of years of the ravages of empires.

Nobody here is in favor of wars of aggression, Rady. Not even Democratic Party or Obama-headed wars of aggression. Genocide isn't only wrong when committed by Republicans, it is also wrong when committed by Democrats. OEN can't see that. I invited you because I'm hoping that, once free of OEN blinders, you can.

Nobody here is in favor of tyranny, Rady. Not even Democratic Party or Obama-headed tyranny. Tyranny is not only wrong when imposed by Republicans, it is also wrong when imposed by Democrats. OEN can't see that. I invited you here because I'm hoping that, once free of OEN blinders, you can.

People who vote for, support, and defend genocide, whatever excuses they may give (genocide is less evil than shooting wolves, genocide might save the polar bears, genocide isn't as bad when we do it as when they do it, etc.) are not good people, Rady.

Some of the people here have known me long before I ever posted at OEN. I have always been, am now, and will remain anti-fascist. Am I full of hatred towards fascism? YOU BET I AM! It has killed billions (not just millions) of innocent people and is still continuing to do so as I write.

It is those who try to appease, collaborate with, or go along to get along with fascism that are the real hatemongers. Hatred against evil is justified. Hatred against those who oppose evil is not. Hatred of fascist evil does not make me just as bad as the fascists. Hatred of fascist evil is just common decency.

I invited you here and to because I'm hoping that you might be interested in learning that OEN is NOT on the left. That neither the Republican nor the Democratic Party is on the left. That Rob Kall is not on the left. That there is a left and it is humanitarian rather than obsessed with status and profits. That opposing fascism is not hatred, it is self-defense and the defense of humanity and of the earth.

You're not likely to be banned either here or on MediaLeft, Rady. If you feel comfortable around anti-fascists, you'll enjoy both sites. If you feel more comfortable in a fascist environment, you won't. Neither site is going to ask you to work for them and neither site will bombard you with fund-raising pleas. You're welcome to post or not, as you see fit. Neither site has a rigid hierarchy, a class or caste system, or takes orders from the big corporations and their political bureaucracies.

If you're looking for fascism, you won't find it here. If you're looking for people who won't stab you in the back when their boss asks them to, you've come to the right place.
"Hatred against evil is justified. Hatred against those who oppose evil is not. Hatred of fascist evil does not make me just as bad as the fascists. Hatred of fascist evil is just common decency."

Note to self : um ... no... hatred against evil is possibly not justified. Evil is as much in the eye of the beholder as beauty I'm afraid. Religious people make a career out of just that kind of philosophy and caused all sorts of unholy shit. The man probably had it right with the 'love thy neighbour ... etc'. End of note to self.
Sorry, Cal. I have no love for the Idi Amins, Hitlers, Stalins, Pol Pots, and other genocidaires of this world, and the only good thing in life is that they're not my neighbors.

To look at the destruction of the earth and the slaughter of millions of innocent people and say, well, that isn't necessarily evil, it is all in the eye of the beholder, separates you from the reality based community as far as I'm concerned.

I'm an atheist and I would include the thousands of years of religious strife in the category of fascist genocides.

While I would not copy their methods, killing randomly (let god sort 'em out), I would definitely quarantine carriers of fascism. If it isn't done before they finish the job of destroying the earth and every living thing on it, we're fucked.
No Mark - I don't think my stray thought separates me one little bit from the reality based community.
I have known a lot of fascists of persuasions ... and the most surprising thing they had in common was an inalienable and complete conviction about their own goodness and the evil of the other and the justification for their own hostility. That has given me a lot to think about whenever I have been prepared to dish out hostility in complete conviction. And it has given me a lot to think about when I notice anti-fascist fascism bubble up in my vicinity. You will never solve a conflict at the level of the conflict - i.e. you can't fight facism with facism of your own. All problems are always solved at the next level up from the level of the conflict. Sometimes it takes a long time to find the creatvity to get there, but it's always worth the wait & the effort. End of notes for this evening.
Equating my WORDS to genocide is beneath contempt, Cal.

No matter how lofty and enlightened your sentiments, I didn't post even hateful words. All I did was speak truth to fascist power.

Show me one example of something I posted that is full of hatred. There's a difference between hating those who commit genocide and expressing it in words, and those who kill because somebody disagrees with their deeply felt beliefs in their own goodness or anything else.

If you think that fascism and genocide are just in the eyes of the beholder, you are not in touch with reality.

If you think that it is possible for the victim of torture to creatively find their way to a higher level and that it is worth the time enduring torture, you're wrong.

Torture of innocents, even those known definitively and indisputably to be innocent, indefinitely and without trial, is official U.S. policy. Official policy of both the Democratic and Republican parties. Official policy of both the Bush and Obama administrations. Officially supported, although sometimes mildly qualified, as in, we wish we didn't have to do this but it is politically necessary, by Rob Kall, OEN, and their senior editorial staff.

I am opposed to torture. I hate it. I will not support it, defend it, or vote for it or for anyone who condones it under any circumstances.

You can show love to the torturers all you want, but I think you're freakin' out of your mind.

I agree fully with Ward Churchill's, Pacifism as Pathology. Using violence to stop someone from raping and killing a baby does NOT make you as bad as the baby-raper. Walking nonchalantly by and saying, "It is all in the eyes of the beholder--we have to seek creative ways to reach out to the baby-raper without stooping to violence ourselves," DOES.
I didn't see cal equating your WORDS with genocide. I did see the point that one must rise above anger. It's hard for me to do it. Hardly a day goes by that I don't wish for an RPG-7 and a couple cases of rockets. Bruce Cockburn: If I had a rocket launcher...

Now the photos are leaking out... and you can bet that's just the toe of the elephant. It blows my mind how many USAns can go tut-tut- yas-yas but... and I don't think cal was doing that. Maybe I have a different take on it living out here in dominionist krakkerland. I'm surrounded by them. They're everywhere. And most of the poor schlebs are too fekkin dumb to even realize they're fascists. That doesn't excuse them. Now I understand how Nazi Germany could have happened... something I grappled with for years.

Careful what you wish for.
Well this began when Rady said that my banning from OEN was justified due to my COMMENTS being full of hate.

Nobody has pointed to a single such comment and I don't believe that there were any.

I think that's a an outright lie.

As for rising above anger, I'm not buying it. I don't even buy rising above violence. I agree fully with Ward Churchill's premise in "Pacifism as Pathology.

Speaking truth to power isn't hate. Calling torture and genocide what they are, isn't hate. Calling those who vote for, fund, support, condone, defend, or even tolerate torture and genocide what they are, isn't hate. Torture and genocide are hate. Comments which advocate voting for those who fund, support, condone, defend, and command torture and genocide are hate. Pointing out what they're doing, isn't hate.

It may be disrespectful and discourteous towards fascists to call them fascists, but it isn't hate. And of course they'll react angrily and violently because they're fascists--that's what they do, what they've always done, and what they will continue to do if we'll all just be polite, courteous, respectful, and stop calling them fascists.

Rady wrote some comments that were supportive of my position when I advocated election boycotts on OEN. Later, when OEN said that election boycott advocacy was no longer welcome, nobody could mention it without getting banned. Rady was still there, still a senior editor, and apparently self-censoring so as not to get banned, for all the good it did. But that's my cause, not Rady's.

Well, I'm not gay. But California banned gay marriages and I support gay marriages. I won't be a part of any organization that favors banning gay marriages. It doesn't matter that it isn't my cause and I won't self-censor in order to be a part of any organization that wants to ban gay marriages. I could, but I won't. I happen to belong to several organizations that advocate gay marriages and none of those which have websites allow homophobic posts. Homophobia is hate. Opposing homophobia is not hate.

Torture and genocide are hate. Opposing them is not hate.

Tyranny is hate. Opposing tyranny is not hate.

Anger is an authentic human emotion. Violence is justified in self-defense and the defense of others. Speaking truth to power may be disrespectful and discourteous, but it is not hate. Exercising power to censor anyone who opposes torture, genocide and tyranny is hate.

I didn't post comments that were full of hate on OEN.

The first time I was banned from OEN it was because Steven the Lesser claimed that I had made a personal attack on someone else. The guy he claimed I had attacked, disagreed, but that didn't matter and I was banned. I hadn't made a personal attack, but by a great leap of imagination and contrary to what I'd written and what the other guy saw, Steven decided it was a personal attack because he said so.

About a year of so later I was allowed to return to OEN and Steven the Lesser took part in a thread where a Democratic Party operative called me vile, crude, hateful names over and over in post after post, I calmly pointed out each time that they were personal attacks, and Steven had no objections to me being attacked. Nor did any of the other editors.

If I'm in a group or forum where one of the leaders starts posting that gay marriage should be banned, should I respond or should I keep my mouth shut so as not to offend anyone and not to risk getting banned?

I'm anti-fascist. Some people aren't anti-fascist. Torture and genocide aren't in the eye of the beholder, they're reality. The erosion of civil rights isn't in the eye of the beholder, it's reality. If you're not angry about them, they will continue as you seek creative and enlightened ways to transcend them without opposing them. And while you are doing that, the evil will continue because all it needs in order to prevail is for you to fail to oppose it.

Unfortunately, the gay movement is relying on the courts and on politicians for their cause. They seem to be unaware that the system is totally corrupt. Why would a system that commits torture and genocide, care about their rights? And if it does, will they turn their heads away from torture and genocide and praise the courts and politicians that uphold torture and genocide, for allowing them their freedoms?

An injury to one is an injury to all. I'm not gay but I support gay rights. I'm not Moslem, but I support Islamic rights. In other words, I'm human, so I support human rights. And because I live on a planet, I also support environmental and animal rights. Because an injury to one is an injury to all and that includes me and excludes nobody. What good would it be if I was the only one with rights?

If I'm walking along minding my own business and suddenly a crazed axe-murderer attacks me, and one of my neighbors sees what is happening and pulls out a gun and aims it at the axe-murderer, I'm not going to shout, "Stop! Don't shoot! Violence will make you just as bad as he is! Let him kill me. Then you can try to get him into counseling and spiritual awakening." And if it is my neighbor that is being attacked and I have the gun, I'll shoot.
How would it feel to be Judenrat... a Rumkowski to select people for "deportation?" When your work is done... you are one of the last aboard the train.


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